Posted by Barbara on February 08, 2003 at 16:06:10:
In Reply to: Re: Aggressive Saltwater Fish only Tank posted by Buddy on February 08, 2003 at 09:40:13:
: Your not just making a comment here, you are like giving a lesson. Thrust me, i need no lesson in fish size. Perhaps you should look at it in another way, why start a 55 for larger aggressive fishes when you know in few months they will be larger then the 3" you bought them? for in smaller tanks like a 55 gal, they is nowhere to swim what-so-ever. And groupers are ambushers once they claim a territory. And as for getting the trigger while just one inch, thats not seen much, some the smaller sizes is from 2 to 2 1/2". Now i have a queen trigger and she was just about 2 1/4", in ten months she`s grown to a size of 11" and today she is 19". And as for saying it be a couple of years before they growing a 55, i wouldn`t ever go by that suggestion, some triggers will go slower then others, but even in a 55, to have 2 triggers in a matter of months grow to 5", with a grouper and lionfish or angelfish is suicide. Now i have a Passer (King angelfish) and is now 12". don`t you worry, my smallest tank is my hospital tank, a 65 gal.
: See all about this so comment your making, i know about feedings and all that, why in the world you go into this anyway, you learn alittle something and want to share with others? I`m a marine hobbyist for 4 1/2 decades, the first 4 years was with freshwater. And it was nice of you to point out it not happen over night a species would out grow a 55, but it wont take years as you put it, not unless you get puffer`s and such, they grow much slower rate. Say aren`t you the person that said i could cover my tanks at that time the ice storm that was few weeks before xmas, i can cover with blankets? I kept on saying that my tank are to large to be able to do that. And i did after 5 days without power had a survival rate. I`m sorry to say i lost my male dragon moray eel, and as now im waiting for a new for the female dragon. In the 180 reef system i lost one my main fishes, the red sea sailfin but the chevon which costed me more lived. I mean many hobbyist were wipe out in the first two days :( after another few weeks i learn that i had a 40% survial rate in all, im talking about all 8 systems i have.
: But as for buying fishes that grow larger then the tank they have, as time goes bye they will learn in the matters that concerns me and this person just either learn that he or she should got larger tank, or pay the price. Now it can be done for a limited amount of time in a 55, but not for years, god no :((
: Well Happy Fishing all ><{{{{">
: Buddy
:
::I would just like to make a comment on fish size. Most saltwater fish grow very large, even damsels get quite large when fully grown given the right size tank.
::Now what really is the question is how fast do they grow and how long before they out grow a tank. Trigger fish if gotten small,1"-2", and kept in a 55gal or 75gal tank can stay in that tank for a couple of years before out growing it. Smaller Angels,Pygmy, will be fine in a 55-75gal tank as would some of the med. size angels like Passer and Majestic and mayn't even out grow the tank for year if ever. Larger angels like queens or French will get large very fast and need large tanks atleast 6" long. Grouper or Snapper can be kept in a 55-75gal tank but with regular feeding will quickly out grow the tank but small one can be kept for a year or so before they out grow the tank. Tangs like the Hippo or Kole can be kept in 55-75gal tanks for years, if gotten small before out growing the tank and needing to be moved into a large tank. You can also get small eels and they will be fine in a 55-75gal tanks for quite a while before out growing it. Lion fish do grow fast and will out grow a 55-75 gal tank pretty fast.
::Alot of how fast a fish grows will depend on the tank size and how much and what you feed it. Also if you have gottn the fish at a small size that will play in how long the fish can be kept in smaller tanks before it out grows it. Rember the maxium size that some of these fish reach will probably never happen in your tank unless the tank is very large and even then it wouldn't happen over nite.
::Now of coarse the large the tank the more happier the fish is.
::Michael
::: I`ll not cover your idea within a 55, if you wan t to go with the 55 i can`t do nothing about it, but to house fishes that grow large and do you plan on changing them in for smaller when they grow? Even the smallest trigger you choose, grows just under 10", i know in one book they say a 55 is good, i wouldn`t go by that, for a 10" fish, i`ll go with no smaller for it alone a 75, better yet a 100 gal tank, i mean they need room to swim and feel happy were they are. Now the Niger grows just under 20" and in one book i heard they say a 75 gal tank for it, god thats nuts, i would go with a 240 if i was going to keep the Niger for his life span. from all the chooses you made, the only one that fits in that 55 is the snowflake, there are some small mean fishes, like a harlequin bass, it grows near to 4" .
::: But if you perfer the larger aggressive fishes, you will need a larger tank , i mean by most the lionfish will be already at a size if 5" to start, and the triggers will be no smaller the 3" but some them grow so fast it make you dizzy., i`ll not suggest you keep so many if it is the idea you have, if you know they are very aggressive, why then think in starting a 55? Understand something, in a closed in system , your fishes have no where to swim to for safety. and whenever you might think in housing 2 triggers in the same tank, first think carefully which two, and then get them at the same time to be place in the main tank at the same time, if one in the tank already and you try to house another later down the road, it mostly not work, and even then if you place them at the same time, be no problem while their still small but sooner or later they will grow, and one will feel its stronger to rule. Why don`t you think for that 55 like maybe clowfishes and so on? Happy Fishing
::: ><{{{{"> Buddy
:::
::::Well thats fine i am taking all suggestions. Well i know i can't keep all those kinds of fish together. I was just giving a few suggestions. How much live rock would you suggest for this 55 gallon setup. My filters are going to be a Ehiem model number 2028 and a berlin hang on style protein skimmer and a Fluval 404 Power Filter. Thos are the three filters i plan to use cause i know the waste production of these fish is enormous. I don't want you to think i'm a total beginner even though this will be my fist marine tank. I have been researching marine systems for years and have finally been able to setup a nice little tank. I will be upgrading to a 180 gallon tank after a year or so. I just want to start small and then i will switch over. All the fish i am would be buying would be from Flying Fish Express. For a Lionfish i wouls probably get a small Volitan. For Eels it would be a Snowflake Moray and for Triggers i would choose out of Picasso, Niger, or Undulated. I know all the dispositions of these fishes. I just want to know what your opinion is to what i should keep in this 55 gallon system for aggressive fish. Thanks.
I understand the temptation to get some of these large fish, they are so cool looking, and you can always upgrade to a larger tank later on, right? Sorry to say, but sometimes you just can't do it when the time comes. (Been there, done that). Then you'll end up with fish maturing and growing in a (relatively) small tank, that end up beating each other to death. Not a pretty sight. Or fish that you end up giving away or selling because you no longer have room for them....
To be honest, I'm not sure how big a tank you would need to keep a trigger from killing or harassing other fish. When they get sexually mature, they get MEAN!!!! Even the "so called" milder trigger like the niger can and will use lionfish as a chew toy. Saw this myself the other day at a car dealer that had a 300g show tank. Poor volitan lionfish was shredded and all due to the attention of a niger trigger......
So be realistic when stocking the tank you have....in a 55g, perhaps one of the dwarf lions, a snowflake eel, a tomato clownfish, yellow tang. You can keep snails, starfish, featherdusters in there too if you desire.
Whatever you decide, just remember that the advice you have recieved here is given with the health/welfare of the animals in mind and for your benefit too.....nothing is more discouraging than having a tank that has constant problems......
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